Zhui Xu

Chapter 941: The night before (middle)

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In Yunzhongfu, the crowd was bustling, the traffic was busy, the trees beside the road had fallen with yellow leaves, the early winter had come, and the atmosphere of slaughter did not invade this bustling big city.

The carriage passed by the street, and Chen Wenjun in the car lifted the curtain, watching the hustle and bustle of the city, and the hawkers coming in from outside: "Fried fruit from old Bianliang! From old Bianliang! Famous fried fruit! Come here! taste it hey"

"Pig's head meat! Authentic southern hand-crafted pig's head meat! Fine..."

"Southern Dynasty imperial banquet cook, our shop is exclusive..."

Jurchen was born as an hunter, and he was bitter in his early years. Although there are traditions and cultures, most of them are actually simple. After the destruction of Liao and Wu, things of these two dynasties were initially taboo, but with the destruction of Jingping and the demands of a large number of Han slaves, people no longer shy away from many things of Liao and Wu culture, after all, they are upright Conquer, and then enjoy, without a pimple in the heart.

Up to now, many luxury goods and restaurants in the name of the old Liao Kingdom and the Wu Dynasty have long been seen in Xijing.

The two sons were sitting on the carriage opposite Chen Wenjun, and when they heard the voices outside, the second son Wanyan Youyi laughed and talked about the pros and cons of the few shops outside. The eldest son Wanyan De retorted: "Does mother think of the south?"

"It won't be long before this Yunzhongfu is no different from Bianliang." Looking at the row upon row of houses passing by the street, Chen Wenjun smiled slightly, "But what is the old Bianliang explosion? Fruits, authentic southern pork... all nonsense."

"After this incident, if the world is at peace, the son will accompany his mother to the south to have a look, maybe the father is willing to go with him." Wanyan Dezhong said, "At that time, if you see anything wrong with the south As expected, my mother opened her mouth to give pointers, and I believe there can be a safe way to do many things."

There was something in Wanyan Dezhong's words, and Chen Wenjun could understand what he meant, she smiled and nodded.

In the future, Jurchen will have the whole world. With the face of Gushen's family, even if Bianliang or the larger Central Plains are to be cut out for fun, it is not a big deal. Mother's heart is concerned with the suffering of the Han people. She went to the south to open her mouth. Many people can feel better because of this, and mother's heart and thoughts will also be stable because of this. This is the thought of brothers Dezhong and Youyi who want to share their mother's worries, and in fact, there is not much problem.

The carriage passed through the city and stopped in front of the gate of Zheng Guogong's mansion. Zheng Guogong is the title of Shi Liai. The old man, holding a cane, greeted him from the main entrance with a smile, and gave the greatest courtesy to the official visit of Mrs. Gushen and the child.

When Jin destroyed the Liao Dynasty, Li Ai entered the state of Jin as an official. He was a famous scholar himself. Although he worshipped under the name of Zongwang, he actually had the most cooperation with Xi Yin, who had profound attainments in Sinology. Chen Wenjun next to Xiyin is also a Han Chinese. Although he is a Southern Han who is generally looked down upon by Han people in Eastern Liaoning, Chen Wenjun is knowledgeable and reasonable and has several exchanges with Shi Liai, and finally won the respect of the other party.

Of course, Shi Liai is a high-ranking official, and Chen Wenjun is a family member. In theory, the two should not have too much involvement, but what will happen in the cloud this time is a bit complicated after all.

After the army's southern expedition, the first batch of Han prisoners sent from the south, about 500 people, will arrive in Yunzhong within a few days.

During the more than ten years of war, the slaves captured by the army from the south were miserable, and there is no need to elaborate here. In this southern expedition, the first batch of Han slaves brought here has its own symbolic meaning. These more than 500 people are all officials or family members of generals who participated in the resistance during the Jurchen southward journey.

For the Jurchens, they are the children of the enemy, making their lives worse than death, which has the effect of killing chickens and warning monkeys.

But to the Han people, these are the blood descendants of heroes.

The news came that Chen Wenjun, who had not been running on the bright side for many years, showed up. As Gushen's wife, she hoped to rescue this group of 500 prisoners. In the early years, she could not do these things, but now Her status has been stabilized, and her two sons, Dezhong and Youyi, have also grown up, making it clear that she will inherit the throne and do great things in the future. She came forward at this time, whether it was successful or not, at least the consequences would not let her in.

She first spread the word in various news outlets of Yunzhong Mansion, and then visited several government offices and offices in the city along the way, and moved out the strict order to treat Han people and the world as one, and talked to officials everywhere. She didn't scold people, she persuaded them to be merciful in front of officials at all levels, and sometimes she shed tears. Mrs. Gushen put on such a gesture, all the officials agreed, but they didn't dare to let go. After a while, she saw her mother's intense emotions. Dezhong and Youyi also participated in the lobbying.

Wanyan Dezhong moved out of his father's usual teachings and explained the way of benevolence and virtue to the Jurchen officials. Wanyan Youyi also believed that Nanwu was destroyed and the resistance was weak. The people of the world show the kindness and generosity of the Jin Kingdom, and this is the foundation of the Jurchen nation for generations to come.

The mother and son made full use of such public opinion, and after setting their posture, they went to visit Zheng Guogong and asked him for mercy. Regarding this matter, the two brothers may just be helping their mother, but Chen Wenjun is relatively firm. All her lobbying is actually to say hello to Shi Liai in advance, waiting for the old man to have enough time to think before officially visiting the door. .

Shi Liai gave him considerable respect, and everyone sat down inside, and after a chat, the old man asked a lot of thoughts about the two brothers Wanyan Dezhong and Youyi recently, and Chen Wenjun brought up the matter of the captives. Shi Li Aizhu held a cane and pondered for a long time before speaking in a hoarse tone.

"I've been thinking about this matter for a few days, but I don't know what kind of result Madam wants to get in this matter?"

"If it is possible, I naturally hope that the imperial court can give amnesty to these five hundred people. In recent years, it has become the general trend to let go of past grievances. I am the king of the world, and the Han people in the south are also His Majesty's people. Unlike in the past, when my army went south, it was decided by the Wu Dynasty, but now the south is mainly about appeasement.

As a Han from the south, Chen Wenjun was marginalized in the circle of Dajin's wives in the early days. After the Jin Dynasty was settled, her position in Xiyin's mansion was gradually stabilized. When she occasionally participated in gatherings, she always kept a low profile. When she opened her mouth, she was only talking about romance, and only a few people knew that she had the brains and skills to keep her from being a woman. At this time, her speech was logical and convincing. Shi Liai held a cane in both hands and just listened.

"Naturally, these reasons are just general trends. In front of the boss, the concubine is not willing to hide it. The main reason for interceding for these five hundred people is not all for the world, but because the concubine came from the south after all. More than two hundred years of the Wu Dynasty, the general trend has passed, and the concubine is inevitably a little pity in the body and mind. Xi Yin is a great hero, married to him for so many years, in the past, I dare not say anything about these things, but now... "

Chen Wenjun took a deep breath: "Now... the Wu Dynasty is dead after all, and the remaining people can be killed or released. The concubine has to come to ask the boss to find a way. Although the Han people in the south are incompetent, they have ruined their ancestors like this. , but the dead are already dead, and the living have to live in the end. Amnesty for these 500 people, the people in the south, can die less, and the Han people who are still alive in the south can also live better in the future. Concubine... remember The kindness of the old man."

"With the word grace, Madam is serious." Shi Liai bowed her head, first said a sentence, and then fell silent for a moment, "Madam has a bright mind, and some old words will not be sold out."

Chen Wenjun nodded: "Please speak bluntly."

"The old man entered Dajin as an official. Although he nominally followed His Royal Highness Zongwang, when it comes to being an official, he has been in the clouds for the longest time. Master Gushen is very knowledgeable, and he is the Shangguan who takes care of the old man and makes him admire the most. There is a reason for this, and it stands to reason that this old man should not hesitate at all when he comes to the door today. But... I am sorry to say that this old man has big concerns in his heart, and his wife is also dishonest."

Chen Wenjun looked at the old man without arguing, nodded lightly, and waited for him to speak.

"The madam just said that it is no longer necessary to kill five hundred prisoners to show the Han people. That's right. In today's world, although the black flag is still entrenched in the southwest, the Han people in Wuhan have no power to return to the sky. However, they decided to In this world, it is not necessarily only the Han people. Today, the most worrying people in this world, within my Daijin, the Jin Kingdom has been in the state of Jin for more than 30 years. This matter, the officials in the middle and below are ignorant, but the lady must understand."

While talking, Shi Liai looked at the brothers Dezhong and Youyi next to him. In fact, he was also teaching and raising points. Wanyan De looked away but nodded, Wanyan Youyi frowned slightly, even though she said the reason, but understood the rejection in the other's words, the two brothers were somewhat uncomfortable. This time, after all, they accompany their mother to come to the door to request, and they have been building momentum for a long time. If Shi Liai refuses, the face of Xi Yin's family will be difficult.

If Xi Yin's family really loses this face, the Shi family will never feel better in the future.

Shi Liai's eyes were gentle, and her slightly hoarse words slowly said: "My Jin Kingdom's fourth expedition against the Wu Dynasty originated from the friction between the east and the west. Even if the Wu Dynasty was overthrown, in the words of outsiders, our Jin Kingdom The dispute between the East and the West may also begin at any time. His Majesty has been in bed for a long time, and is now struggling to support it, waiting for the moment when this war ends. At that time, the Jin Kingdom will encounter the biggest test in thirty years. , and even life and death in the future will be decided at that moment.”

"The five hundred people who were brought here first were not for the Han people, but for the people inside Dajin." The old man said, "Since the army's expedition, there have been some people in our Jin Kingdom who are just about to move, and there are small disturbances outside. My grandson... After Yuanji passed away, there have been people playing the game in private. Those who can't see the situation think that my family is dead. Someone must be doing things in Yunzhong Mansion. Short-sighted people make bets in advance. This is the norm. , Some people are provoking, that is the reason for the intensification."

"Since Yuanji's death, from Shangjing to Yunzhong, there have been countless riots. In July, Zhongsheng and Wanyan Huizhang were even taken by strong men because of their participation in private riots. Sixty-one people in the family were killed. , the strongman who killed Zhongshenghou died in the fire, and the government failed to find out the clues. But if someone hadn't interfered, with the strength of my big gold at this time, a few strongmen would have been fed up. He ran to kill the whole family of a county and a prince. This method has something in common with Yuan Ji's death... The good disciple of the inner demon in the south... "

The old man's eyes were as calm as water. When he said this, he looked at Chen Wenjun in an ordinary way, and Chen Wenjun also looked at it calmly. The old man lowered his eyes.

"My big money is worried about internal and external troubles... If these words are in front of others, the old man will not say them. 'Mrs. Han' is a bodhisattva, and the old man has admiration for the things he has done over the years. No one disturbed Mrs.…”

When the old man said this, there was a thorn in his words, and Wanyan Dezhong stood up next to him and cupped his hands: "Is there something wrong with the old man's words?"

Chen Wenjun waved his hand at his son: "The boss has a big picture, which is admirable. Over the years, the concubine has indeed saved many people who suffered in the south in private, and the gods know this. Let's not hide the boss, the people of the Wu Dynasty, The people of the black flag have privately tested the concubine body several times, but the concubine body is unwilling to have more contact with them. First, there is no way to be a human being. Second, it is also selfish. If you want to protect them, at least you don’t want these people to have an accident. , because of the concubine. I also went to the boss for a clear inspection."

"Human feelings." Shi Liai's crutches were on the ground, nodded slowly, and then sighed slightly, "Compared to a family and a country, the body of one person is too insignificant, the world's feelings are like a turbulent river and sea, rushing past, No one can resist. Yuanji is my most beloved grandson. I thought I could inherit the family business, but suddenly it is gone. There are eighty-one old people. Recently, I often feel that the destiny is coming, and the future storm, the old man is afraid I can't see it anymore, but Madam still has to watch it. You have to watch Dezhong and Youyi too, and you have to turn the tide. It's very difficult."

When the old man said this, only a few people knew that the sharpness in his words was also a reminder to Wanyan Dezhong and Wanyan Youyi. Chen Wenjun asked the two to thank them, and the two also stood up and saluted. Shi Li Ai paused.

"Five hundred prisoners have been brought here in a hurry, in order to show everyone that the South has won the battle, and my Jurchen enemies will all end here. Moreover, it is also to let people see the capabilities of the West if there is friction in the future. Because of this matter, Madam said she wanted to let them go, but she couldn't let them go. I want these prisoners to go through the streets in Yunzhong City and show them outside. They are family members of sinners, they will be beaten to death, and maybe they will be sold. Some. These things have to be done anyway."

At this point, Shi Liai took out a list from his arms, and before it was started, Chen Wenjun opened his mouth: "Boss, I once asked Gu Shen's opinion about things, although everyone felt that there were two sides of the east and west. There is bound to be a great chaos, but Gu Shen’s views are different.”

"Oh?"

"Gu Shen once said that the commander is arrogant, and his life is only for the Jurchen, not for power and status. Even if the situation changes one day, the commander will not participate in this competition. In this southern expedition, the commander will It is to suppress these hidden dangers with record.”

"... Then if Zongfu Zongbi and the two Highnesses attack, will the commander sit still and wait to die?"

"If the commander can win this battle, the two Your Royal Highnesses may not attack."

"..." Shi Liai was silent for a moment, then put the list on the coffee table and pushed it over, "It's just as Madam said, it is also a chance of victory in the west, and the world will not be in trouble. The five hundred prisoners paraded through the streets to show the public, they It is to increase the bargaining power in the west. For this matter, please forgive the old man for not letting go. But after the parade, except for some important people who could not let go, the old man made a list of 200 people, and the madam can lead them over and go on her own. arrange."

The five hundred prisoners gave 40%. This is the face of Xiyin's house. Chen Wenjun looked at the list, and did not extend her hand in silence. She wanted to save more people, but the old man had already let go of his hand:

"... Not only these five hundred people, but once the war is over, there will still be hundreds of thousands of Han Chinese who will be brought over from the south. Compared with the lives of more than 100,000 people, who can say clearly? He is from the south, but unlike the Han people in the south, who are timid and timid, the old man has admiration in his heart, but in the face of the general trend of the world, even if the lady saves thousands of people, it is just a game. , Madam Wenjun likes to do it on her own."

Chen Wenjun slowly stretched out his hand and took the list: "As the old man said, one person is too insignificant, and the world's affairs are washed away like a river, so insignificant people like me can do something to comfort myself, what else can I do. After all, I came from the south, and I can’t change it. I’m married to a Jurchen, and I’m afraid it won’t change in this life… These self-willed requests make it difficult for the boss to do, and if the concubine knows whether it should be done or not, I will ask the boss for forgiveness.”

She used the power of Xiyin's house to force her to the door. It must be difficult for the old man to do it, but Shi Liai is also a wise person. His words are slightly thorny. Some things are broken, and some things are not broken. Whether the flag has anything to do with it, and what Shi Li thinks in love, is naturally impossible for others to know. Even if his grandson died, he never pursued Chen Wenjun's past. This is the heart and wisdom of the overall situation.

The list of 200 people, the face of both sides, is still passable. Chen Wenjun accepted the list with a little bitterness in her heart, she knew that all her efforts might end here. Shi Liai smiled and said, "If Madam wasn't so smart, and if she was really willful, she would be able to get better in the future."

Chen Wenjun smiled bitterly and did not answer, saying: "After the matter is over, if there is still room for the remaining three hundred people, I hope the boss will take care of them."

Shi Liai nodded: "Definitely."

Having said that, there is nothing serious to talk about next. Chen Wenjun cared about Shi Liai's body and exchanged a few words. The old man got up and slowly sent the mother and son out with a cane. After all, the old man is very old. After talking for a while, he can clearly see his tiredness. He coughed from time to time on the way to say goodbye. A servant with medicine came to remind the old man to drink the medicine. The old man also waved his hand and insisted on taking the medicine. Chen Wenjun's mother and son will do this after they leave.

Although they belong to each other in terms of identity and origin, in all fairness, Dajin of the past era, whether Jurchen, Liaochen or Hanchen, actually has his own strong side. At that time, Li Ai was also a high-ranking official at the end of the Liao Kingdom. Later, the Liao Dynasty destroyed Jinxing and the world changed drastically. Although he was a Han Chinese, he never looked down upon the habits of the Han people in the south.

During the years of joining the Jin Kingdom, Shi Liai has done a great job of advising and planning for the court. Although he is old, he still stands firmly in the last post, and can be regarded as the mainstay in the cloud.

Last year, Tang Minjie killed his son, secretly stirring up troubles and sowing discord, but the implementation of most of the conspiracy was moved outside the Yunzhong Mansion. .

In July of this year, several groups of people from the east of Yunzhongfu participated in the population business. Even though he never asked about this kind of thing in person, Chen Wenjun could guess that only the lunatic Tang Minjie could do it.

If Shi Liai hadn't been sitting in the cloud, maybe that madman would be making waves in the city, and he would have really demolished the Yunzhongfu Dazaoyuan.

With this in mind, she silently collected the list given by Shi Liai. One day later, she secretly made an appointment with Heiqi's contact here. This time, Lu Mingfang was not in the clouds. When she saw Tang Minjie who came forward as the person in charge again, he was dressed in rags and had drooping eyebrows. With a stooped figure, it looks like a Han slave is a coolie. Thinking about it, he has already left the Nagua vegetable shop, and he is planning something recently.

Chen Wenjun hoped that the two sides could join forces and try their best to save the 500 heroic families who were escorted this time. Since he was talking about business, Tang Minjie did not show the slick image he had before. After quietly listening to Chen Wenjun's proposal, he nodded and said, "Since Mrs. Chen is interested in such a thing, as long as there is a plan and hope for success, Huaxia The army will naturally try its best to help.”

"Master Ugly doesn't have it, but didn't mention it?" Chen Wenjun smiled and stabbed him. In the past year or two, as Tang Minjie has been acting more and more, the name of the clown is not only a mere gangster in the North, but a huge disaster that makes many people feel disgusted, Chen Wenjun said at this time. Ugly lord, in fact, it can be regarded as the rule of the people on the road.

Tang Minjie's eyes were calm: "However, since things will happen in Yunzhongfu, Shi Liai must be prepared for this. Mrs. Chen must know this. Speaking of saving people, Huaxia Army can trust you. If you already have A perfect plan, what help is needed, you speak, we will contribute. If there is no perfect plan, then I have to ask the next question."

"These five hundred people crossed the border and went north to Yunzhong, affecting all aspects, but the escort army is not less than five thousand, how can there be any complete strategy. The ugly master is good at planning and playing with people's hearts. I want to hear the ugly master's thoughts here. ."

"Then it depends on how determined Mrs. Chen is to do things."

"What's the meaning?"

"I mean, in Madam's mind, these things are now regarded as leisure pastimes, a little adjustment to comfort themselves. Or they are still regarded as wars between the two countries, using all kinds of extremes, and fighting endlessly."

In the current meeting, Tang Minjie's expression was serious and deep, and he behaved seriously and professionally, which actually made Chen Wenjun's perception a lot better. But when she said this, she still frowned slightly, Tang Minjie didn't care, he sat on the stool, lowered his head, and looked at his fingers.

"Of course, I have no other thoughts about Madam's thoughts. No matter what kind of expectations, Madam has already done everything she can do. As a Han Chinese, you must be regarded as a hero. These thoughts are only related to the way of doing things. s difference."

Tang Minjie said: "If the former, Madam wants to save these five hundred people, but she doesn't want to hurt herself too much, at least she doesn't want to put herself in, then we will have a measure of stopping when we do things here. We can't do anything, we just don't do it, and try our best to get out of the way."

"...If it's the latter." Tang Minjie paused, "If Madam treats these things as an omnipotent slaughter, if Madam anticipates her own affairs, it is actually harming the interests of Jin Guo, and we will tear it apart. , to defeat it, the ultimate goal is to destroy the Jin Kingdom and let everything your husband built up will eventually burn to us. People who will try their best to take more risks, will consider murder, kidnapping, threats... and even put themselves on it, The stop loss point that my teacher said, will be lower. Because if you have such expectations, we will definitely be willing to accompany you to the end.”

Tang Minjie lowered his head, and Chen Wenjun stared at him. After a long silence in the room, Chen Wenjun finally said, "You are worthy of being a disciple of inner demons."

"It's just for coordinating things. If things get bigger, some people will rush forward, some people will retreat, and in the end, a large group of people will die. It's just work, Madam is serious."

"...Do you really think that you can destroy the entire Jin Kingdom?"

"That's what we're here for, isn't it?"

"...You guys, can you do it?"

Tang Minjie looked up at her, smiled and then lowered his head to look at his fingers: "This time is different from the past, the relationship between the Jin Kingdom and the Wu Dynasty, and the relationship with the Huaxia Army, it is difficult to become as balanced as Liao Wu, we can't There have been two hundred years of peace. So the final result must be your life and death. I imagined the situation when the entire Huaxia army was defeated, I imagined the situation when I was caught, and thought about it hundreds of times, but Mrs. Chen, Have you ever thought about the consequences of your actions, Wanyan Xiyin will die, and your two sons will also die. You choose to stand, this is the consequence of choosing a side, if you don't choose a side... We at least have to know where to stop."

Chen Wenjun's fists were already clenched, her fingernails were embedded in her palms, her body trembled slightly, she looked at Tang Minjie: "Is it interesting to say all these things? You seem to be very smart? Is it because I don't do things, you Are you happy?"

"...On the contrary, I admire your sacrifices." Tang Minjie looked at her, "It's not easy for you to get to this point. My teacher once said that most of the time, people in the world hope that they can be fooled. If you think about it, it might get better the next day, but it’s actually impossible. What you avoid today will be recovered one day in the future, and even the interest will be counted. You are a great heroine, think about it early, Knowing what you're doing will make things a little bit better."

His words stinged Chen Wenjun, she stood up from her seat, took two steps in the room, and then said: "Do you really think there is any future? The war in the southwest is about to start, you are far away in the clouds. I have seen Nianhan, I have seen Xiyin, I have lived with Xiyin all my life! We know who they are! I know how they defeated the Liao Kingdom! They are the heroes of the world! They are tenacious and unyielding! If Xiyin was not me My husband is my enemy, and I will tremble with fear!"

Chen Wenjun's tone was suppressed, his teeth gritted: "The sword pavilion has fallen! The southwest has already started fighting! The leader is Nianhan, and he has conquered half of the Jin Kingdom! He is not a mediocre like Zongfu Zongbi. The Chaos is just an addition! The Southwest Black Flag is the place they are determined to destroy! No matter the cost! Do you really think there is a future

"If it really gets to that point, the surviving Han people may only be able to rely on the kindness of Madam. But Madam also doesn't know what kind of person my teacher is, whether it's Nianhan or Xiyin, even if Agu fights back to life, I won't be able to do it in this battle. Also believe in my comrades in the Southwest, they will surely win."

Tang Minjie was not moved by Chen Wenjun's words, but said indifferently: "Mrs. Chen, if the Huaxia Army is really defeated, it may be the best result for Madam. But if things go a little wrong, the army will return to the south. At that time, it was the beginning of the civil strife in the east and west of Jin. One day, Xi Yin died, and your two sons were not spared, can you accept that you made them come this far?"

"If you expected such a result, you would cooperate, and we will give you our life. If you do not want such a result, just to comfort yourself, of course we will try our best to help and save people. If you take a step back... Mrs. Chen, The face of the Gushen family, the more than 200 people saved, it is very remarkable, Mrs. Han has saved the hardships, thousands of families have been born Buddhas, everyone will thank you."

Tang Minjie said here, no more words, quietly waiting for these words to ferment in Chen Wenjun's heart. Chen Wenjun was silent for a long time, and suddenly remembered the conversation at Shiliai's mansion the day before. The old man said, "Even if my grandson had an accident, the old man didn't let anyone disturb the madam..."

At first, Chen Wenjun thought that it was Shi Liai's counterattack and sharpness to force her to come to the door, but at this time, she vaguely felt that it was the old man who also saw the precariousness of Jin Guo and himself. Swing left and right will inevitably encounter a dilemma in the future, so I opened my mouth and woke up.

Of course, Shi Liai's purpose in breaking this matter is to hope that she will recognize Madam Gushen's position from now on, and not make any big mistakes. Tang Minjie's point of view at this time may be that he hopes that his will against Jin will be more determined, that he can do more and more outrageous things, and finally even shake the foundation of the entire Jin Kingdom.

Smart people do things in similar ways, even though their positions are different.

"...Do you really think that you can win?"

"I have no idea."

"… "

Chen Wenjun closed his eyes, unable to make a choice. The prosperous pulse of Yunzhongfu is coming from his feet and from the wind. This is the accumulation of more than 20 years since the establishment of the Great Jin Dynasty. Countless people fought and fought and became rich in the world. A giant, not many people can imagine its collapse.

"…I'll think about it."

"Should think about it."

Tang Minjie said.